Friday, December 21, 2012

Who's That New Guy With The Long Hair?

A lot of religious folks are saying we should put Jesus back in the schools. I'm sure the NRA would go along with that as long as He's packing heat.

32 comments:

free0352 said...

Luke 22:49

When Jesus' followers saw what was going to happen, they said, "Lord, should we strike with our swords?"

Jesus disciples carried weapons.

John 18:10

Then Simon Peter having a sword drew it, and smote the high priest's servant, and cut off his right ear. The servant's name was Malchus.

Jesus' crew was pack'n the heat of the day. Swords, personal weapons of the Soldier.

Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.

-Jesus of Nazareth, Matthew 10:34

Exodus 22:2-3

If the thief is found breaking in, and he is struck so that he dies, there shall be no guilt for his bloodshed.

I may be an atheist but I spent 8 years in religious school, and 14 in forced bible study. I love how you libs will use the Bible when it is convenient to your agenda, but ignore the deeper meaning.

free0352 said...

Whoops, forgot this one

Luke 22:35-39

And He said to them, "When I sent you without money bag, knapsack, and sandals, did you lack anything?" So they said, "Nothing." Then He said to them, "But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one. For I say to you that this which is written must still be accomplished in Me: 'And He was numbered with the transgressors.' For the things concerning Me have an end." So they said, "Lord, look, here are two swords." And He said to them, "It is enough." Coming out, He went to the Mount of Olives, as He was accustomed, and His disciples also followed Him.

Jesus ordered his followers to buy arms. It was a commandment strait from the son of god.

jim marquis said...

I was just making a bad joke, Free. But, whatever...

free0352 said...

Well, your joke just fell flat in the face of history.

free0352 said...

Were Jesus alive today, his disciples would have AR-15s, as swords were the assault weapons of their era. They only had one purpose, killing men.

clif said...

As Paul Harvey used to say, and now for the REST of the story;

Luke 22:49-51

49 When Jesus’ followers saw what was going to happen, they said, “Lord, should we strike with our swords?”

50 And one of them struck the servant of the high priest, cutting off his right ear.

51 But Jesus answered, “No more of this!” And he touched the man’s ear and healed him.



HMMMM he didn't want them to USE them.

same thingy concerning the John quote;

John 18:10-11

10 Then Simon Peter, who had a sword, drew it and struck the high priest's servant, cutting off his right ear. (The servant's name was Malchus.)

11 Jesus commanded Peter, "Put your sword away! Shall I not drink the cup the Father has given me?"


same result, do NOT use the sword>


Matthew 26:52

Then Jesus said to him, "Put your sword back into its place; for all those who take up the sword shall perish by the sword.

Same thingy freebee, he said DON'T use the sword. Jesus even refused the use of the sword to defend his life.


Here the person YOU are trying to twist his quotes to use for your extreme ideology say NO you cannot use it that way.

Matthew 5:38-40

38 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’

39 But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also.

40 And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well.

and Luke 6:27-30

27 “But to you who are listening I say: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,

28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.

29 If someone slaps you on one cheek, turn to them the other also. If someone takes your coat, do not withhold your shirt from them.

30 Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back.
?

same here.

(cont)

clif said...

As for your cheery picking the Matthew 10 quote;

It does NOT mean what you dishonestly claim it does;

Here is the entire chapter so the quote is IN CONTEXT;

Jesus Sends Out the Twelve

10 Jesus called his twelve disciples to him and gave them authority to drive out impure spirits and to heal every disease and sickness.

2 These are the names of the twelve apostles: first, Simon (who is called Peter) and his brother Andrew; James son of Zebedee, and his brother John; 3 Philip and Bartholomew; Thomas and Matthew the tax collector; James son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus; 4 Simon the Zealot and Judas Iscariot, who betrayed him.

5 These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: “Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans. 6 Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel. 7 As you go, proclaim this message: ‘The kingdom of heaven has come near.’ 8 Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy,[a] drive out demons. Freely you have received; freely give.

9 “Do not get any gold or silver or copper to take with you in your belts— 10 no bag for the journey or extra shirt or sandals or a staff, for the worker is worth his keep. 11 Whatever town or village you enter, search there for some worthy person and stay at their house until you leave. 12 As you enter the home, give it your greeting. 13 If the home is deserving, let your peace rest on it; if it is not, let your peace return to you. 14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet. 15 Truly I tell you, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.

16 “I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves. 17 Be on your guard; you will be handed over to the local councils and be flogged in the synagogues. 18 On my account you will be brought before governors and kings as witnesses to them and to the Gentiles. 19 But when they arrest you, do not worry about what to say or how to say it. At that time you will be given what to say, 20 for it will not be you speaking, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you.


(cont)

clif said...

21 “Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; children will rebel against their parents and have them put to death. 22 You will be hated by everyone because of me, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. 23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

24 “The student is not above the teacher, nor a servant above his master. 25 It is enough for students to be like their teachers, and servants like their masters. If the head of the house has been called Beelzebul, how much more the members of his household!

26 “So do not be afraid of them, for there is nothing concealed that will not be disclosed, or hidden that will not be made known. 27 What I tell you in the dark, speak in the daylight; what is whispered in your ear, proclaim from the roofs. 28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell. 29 Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground outside your Father’s care.[b] 30 And even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. 31 So don’t be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows.

32 “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.

34 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to turn

“‘a man against his father,
a daughter against her mother,
a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law—
36 a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.’[c]

37 “Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 Whoever does not take up their cross and follow me is not worthy of me. 39 Whoever finds their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.

40 “Anyone who welcomes you welcomes me, and anyone who welcomes me welcomes the one who sent me. 41 Whoever welcomes a prophet as a prophet will receive a prophet’s reward, and whoever welcomes a righteous person as a righteous person will receive a righteous person’s reward. 42 And if anyone gives even a cup of cold water to one of these little ones who is my disciple, truly I tell you, that person will certainly not lose their reward.”


see freebee this was Jesus sending out his disciples NOT telling everyone to grab a sword, but a dishonest ideologically pushing person doesn't care how they twist anything except to achieve their temporary goal.

He denied his own disciples the use of the sword to defend his own life, and of course under his preaching your ideological right to use it, or LIE about what he really said..

clif said...

Exodus 22:2-3

If the thief is found breaking in, and he is struck so that he dies, there shall be no guilt for his bloodshed.


Jewish Law which Jesus amended with Matthew 5:38-40 and Luke 6:27-30 (see above)

clif said...

Freebee still dishonestly cherry picking to defend his anti-Christian extreme ideology

free0352 said...

No cliff, I don't see it.

What do you suppose Jesus had his disciples carrying swords for? Even short roman style swords (Gladius) were pretty hard to hide. He would have seen them. And clearly Simon didn't worry about much when he struck a man in the head with one. The only reason Jesus told him to stop was (assuming he wasn't a total lunatic which I believe he was) that he knew he must be delivered up for judgment and be crucified and did not want God's mission hindered by his armed and ready followers.

free0352 said...

Jewish Law which Jesus amended

Sorry, Jewish law still in effect

Mathew 5:17

"Don't misunderstand why I have come. I did not come to abolish the [jewish] law of Moses or the writings of the prophets. No, I came to accomplish their purpose."

clif said...

No cliff, I don't see it.

I know YOU don't, but most Christian do.

clif said...

freebee your still cherry picking to defend an extreme ideology which stand in direct contrast with the words Jesus spoke about turning the other cheek.

Just like the clowns who push the prosperity gospel in contrast of Jesus's words there is no earthly reward, but only a heavenly reward.

You both are trying to distort gospel which is not what Jesus was about.

clif said...


Sorry, Jewish law still in effect


which is why I said

amended, freebee,

Amended does not mean the law is not in effect just changed by the life of Jesus, and his sacrifice.

Still stuck on stupid in reading comprehension I see, heck you even copied the word but couldn't or wouldn't comprehend the meaning.

free0352 said...

Another stunning comeback worth of small children. A sophomoric mind breeds sophomoric response.

Another quote from the Bible-

Deuteronomy 23:1

No one who has been emasculated may enter the assembly of the LORD

You may be in danger of being tossed out of heaven dude. According to Moses' law anyway.

free0352 said...

I don't even believe it Cliff... which makes it all the more hilarious that I know it better than you do.

Jesus said quite frankly, that he did not come to change the law, but to complete its purpose I.E. on the cross. All laws, in effect. All of them. Nothing changed. He was asked specifically about that, and he answered very clearly.

You can try to manipulate the Bible to justify your liberal pacifism if you want. I could care less. But T-Paine is going to laugh his ass off when he reads this because you just got your ass handed to you by an atheist in a religious debate.

clif said...

Only in your deluded mind freebee

only in your deluded mind.


Keep laughing, your losing more and more political power, every day.

Especially after the clown show the NRA put on today.

clif said...

You gun fetishists are as deluded and the clowns who thought the world was ending yesterday.

clif said...

But keep laughing in oyu delusions.


BTW, I don't care what T-boy thinks or says, he is just as delusional as you are.

free0352 said...

BTW, I don't care what T-boy thinks or says, he is just as delusional as you are.

Yeah, but I do. Thanks for being our punch line. Play again soon.

free0352 said...

As for my beliefs, I tend to go more the uncle Temujin route.

"I am the scourge of God...If you had not committed great sins, God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you."

To crush your enemies, and see them fall at your feet - to take their horses and belongings, and to hear the lamentation of their women. That is the best life.

clif said...

Yeah, but I do.

we know YOU do,

the dumb and dumber routine.

One posits an incredible dumb extreme right wing talking point, and the second agrees with it.

Your claims of victory are as hollow as your ideology.

You have proven nothing except how shallow your position is when you have to cherry pick the bible to defend it.

and you didn't "ass handed to you by an atheist in a religious debate" at all.

You totally ignore the context of the bible to try to cherry pick individual lines with out any reference to their FULL meaning. A meaning that requires the religious faith they support you deride.

You only revealed the lack of the ability to defend your position, here just as you have revealed the shallowness of your supposed patriotism with your posts about the violent reactions you intend, if the US Constitution is followed and lawful constitutional regulations are passed and enforced.

You usage of Deuteronomy 23:1,

"If a man's testicles are crushed or his penis is cut off, he may not be admitted to the assembly of the LORD."

and your non biblical definition of what it means shows that.


You boast so much, but actually accomplish so little here.

Cause if you are truly an atheist, then the underlying meaning is gone for you, the lines you quote are dead to be used, not live to be lived. that is why you cling to the guns you are so fetishistic over, cause you have no faith in anything else, by your own admission, a truly sad way to live.

clif said...

Jesus said quite frankly, that he did not come to change the law, but to complete its purpose

stands in complete contrast to the very stark difference between;

Exodus 21:22-25

22 “If people are fighting and hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely[a] but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman’s husband demands and the court allows.

23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life,

24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot,

25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise.


and Jesus comment directly on that part of the "law"

Matthew 5:38-39

38 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’[a]

39 But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also.


In Jesus words the "law" was changed.

To deny that is almost delusional if you will.

You want the Old Testement law to stand when in the New Testement, Jesus refused to allow it.

Just as Jesus life and sacrifice was Gods grace to man, Jesus was demanding we give grace to each other.

To deny that just to push your extreme ideology, is simply incredible.

But then again, I must remember you refuse to believe in anything but your gun fetish.

T. Paine said...

Free, you are right. I am laughing my ass off.

Cliff, I don’t know if you are a Christian or not, but you do seem to take great pleasure in your nastiness and mostly wrong-headed interpretations of scripture, Thomas Jefferson quotations, threats to liberty, and assorted historically-disproven Keynesian-economic theories. For someone that is wrong so often, I would think you would exhibit a more humble heart, my friend.

clif said...

For someone that is wrong so often

Ain't wrong T-boy, you need to look in de mirror and take your own advice.

S.W. Anderson said...

To the extent anyone attending a school believes in Jesus, Jesus is still in the school. Anyone who wants to pray in school is free to do that, at least at appropriate times and in ways that don't distract others or become disruptive.

What those who bemoan the lack of Jesus in school really want is to make the public schools places that instill Christian fundamentalist beliefs in children. There are private schools where that kind of teaching is available, but they want all schools to do it.

It's ironic that so many Christian conservatives want to entrust public schools with instilling religious faith in their children and other people's children, since so many of them claim public schools and public school teachers are mediocre or no good.

free0352 said...

While I do not think any religion is the appropriate vector to do this, I do think we need to be teaching values and morality in schools. The military does a very good job of this in a largely secular manner.

We need to start be defining what it is to be a man, what a mans roles and jobs are in society, and expecting young men to act like it.

Being strong and tough, responsible, industrious, protecting the weak and innocent, condemning those who do not meet standards of behavior, all those things aren't exclusively Christian values. Christianity doesn't have a monopoly on traditional chivalry and we desperately need a return to those values. The new age, sensitive male world view fails the individual and society and I think turns some young men into monsters in its vacuum. Not necessarily the active shooter; but the gang banger? Oh yes. We need to define what it is to be a man again, and the old pre 1960s man is the superior model, and we need to teach that.

clif said...

old pre 1960s man is the superior model

Who's version?

There was only one "culturally" approved version, which is sorta where I see your ideological screeching going, given the pre 1960's desire of turning the clock backwards.

The WASP "strong silent type"version, (IE John Wayne) which would end up in direct conflict cause that "man" had to have faith in the time period you long for.

See you are pining for something that in reality did not exist except for the historical revisionism that exists in the extreme right wing who for some reason whines about the good old days, who except for the privileged right people, weren't such good old days.

But do continue to push your delusions here, they are entertaining at least.

SeattleStamper said...

I'm so sick of those types of comments. Whatever happened to "Jesus is everywhere"?

free0352 said...

We damn sure could use a lot more strong silent types. Or just strong. You don't need religion to teach things like how to become a hard working, self reliant defender of the weak.

clif said...

We damn sure could use a lot more strong silent types.

Good if ya mean the childish teatards are gonna STFU for a while, even if they ain't exactly what you pretend they are.